[Udunson]

I think that it is incredible that ONE person can change a tier list DRASTICALLY, and people will believe everything he says. Since Elementz says Galio is good, people at 12-1500 elo will start banning galio in solo queue games, even though it does not pertain to their elo, or playstyle. Now, I do believe Galio is good, I'm not saying he isn't. But I don't think 1 person should have the option to change the meta game with a few quick adjustments to his tier list.

This post has been edited by Udunson: 08 October 2010 - 05:06 PM
Reason for edit: Thread wasn't clear.

[Tiumus]

I think Anivia has been the same strength for a while now...what I think he's saying is he didn't realize all the ways she can impact a game...Take ManyReason's Anivia for example...also, he's just trying to assess the characters values to a team and what they offer towards the current meta...which is in NA heavily reliant on team fighting, that of which nidalee really kind of sucks at. There are comments in his post that say to take it with a grain of salt, because they are based on his opinions, but In my opinion you should value his opinion considering how well he does.

[Dret]

Udunson, on 07 October 2010 - 06:57 PM, said:

So I just read Elementz tier list, and I'm gonna have to say it's pretty bad.

If only Elementz prefaced his tier list with something like "This is MY opinion solely and does not reflect my team's or any other high level player opinion on high level play. It's for you to read and discuss for your enjoyment and nothing else."

[iATEparisHILTONsCAKE]

anivia is really amazing in league of legends, one of the "safest" option as a caster in league. the thing is that CLG won against SK but SK isn't the best in europe in any way. There are many players who can compete with them like 2-3 in 5 matchs + many of players can't compete in WCG qualify since WCG doesn't allow many countries in their tourney. You really don't know a shit about Europe scene due to this fact do talk about anivia is a bad

however, I do not agree with this list either. current phase of the game has 6-10 champions, which are JUST THE BEST no matter what tactic, playstyle, your level, or whatever you're using, they're just the best. there are like 5 champions who are just the worst in the game by any factor. the rest (middle) are equal good.

[Nanners]

Nid is that low because it'sa competitive tier list and nid has no place in true competitive play. Look at hotshotgg @ WCG and nationals, he didn't choose nid for a reason. She is extremely gopod at stomping baddies.

Anivia has a stun that you can cleanse and can't be reduced by merctreads, and thats her wall glitch. While its a glitch it means GG to whomever gets caught in it.

Galio has one of the best ults in the game if not the best. The only ult that does more base damage is Nunu's. He makes for a great last/second to last pick. He synergizes very well with aoe teams.

Ashe? Global stun + A free clairvoy? How is this not top tier.

Annie? Best caster next to a wall glitching Anivia. I really don't understand how this is complicated.

Sona? Best laner in game atm, most dps lvls 1-9 + heals. She has excellent deny and synergizes amazingly with aoe. Shes like taric, except she has an AoE stun and raises MR as well as movespeed. Though maybe not as tanky.

While I don't agree with many options, I don't see how you could call especially those picks wrong in competitive play.

[flngmnk]

Tier 1: Galio, Morgana, Amumu, Ashe, Sona, Garen, Warwick, Kog'Maw, Janna, Anivia, Annie, Taric, Shen
Tier 2: Miss Fortune, Tristana, Twitch, Kennen, Kassadin, Twisted Fate, Xin Zhao, Udyr, Vladimir, Ezreal, Olaf, Shaco, Sion, Pantheon

A good goal for a player who wants to become highly competitive is to master all these champions. There is no reason he has to start mastering anivia while still in the 1500's on the way up.

[wale]

His list seems more accurate than not. Obviously, there will be opinion differences (IMO Kayle and GP should be higher) from person to person. And he never claims that list to be universal for all Elos, in fact, I'm pretty sure he's taking it purely from a premade high elo standpoint

[DerWille]

Nanners, on 07 October 2010 - 07:10 PM, said:

Nid is that low because it'sa competitive tier list and nid has no place in true competitive play. Look at hotshotgg @ WCG and nationals, he didn't choose nid for a reason. She is extremely gopod at stomping baddies.

Anivia has a stun that you can cleanse and can't be reduced by merctreads, and thats her wall glitch. While its a glitch it means GG to whomever gets caught in it.

Galio has one of the best ults in the game if not the best. The only ult that does more base damage is Nunu's. He makes for a great last/second to last pick. He synergizes very well with aoe teams.

Ashe? Global stun + A free clairvoy? How is this not top tier.

Annie? Best caster next to a wall glitching Anivia. I really don't understand how this is complicated.

Sona? Best laner in game atm, most dps lvls 1-9 + heals. She has excellent deny and synergizes amazingly with aoe. Shes like taric, except she has an AoE stun and raises MR as well as movespeed. Though maybe not as tanky.

While I don't agree with many options, I don't see how you could call especially those picks wrong in competitive play.

I agree with you.

[Udunson]

I just disagree with a lot of it.

Now, it may be pretty accurate at high elo, but, at 1300 elo, people just look at Elementz tier list, and instantly say everything he says is correct. And will most likely start to ban Galio.

[Twitch]

Udunson, on 07 October 2010 - 06:57 PM, said:

So I just read Elementz tier list, and I'm gonna have to say it's pretty bad.


Tier 1: Galio, Morgana, Amumu, Ashe, Sona, Garen, Warwick, Kog'Maw, Janna, Anivia, Annie, Taric, Shen
Tier 2: Miss Fortune, Tristana, Twitch, Kennen, Kassadin, Twisted Fate, Xin Zhao, Udyr, Vladimir, Ezreal, Olaf, Shaco, Sion, Pantheon
Tier 3: Heimerdinger, Corki, Veigar, Zilean, Poppy, Akali, Rammus, Nasus, Kayle, Nunu, Gragas, Singed, Mordekaiser, Yi, Karthus.
Tier 4: Sivir, Fiddlesticks, Malphite, Soraka, Blitzcrank, Gangplank, Nidalee.
Hard to place on a team: Swain, Jax, Katarina, Alistar, Ryze, Urgot, Eve, Teemo, Mal'zahar, Tryndamere, Cho'Gath, Mundo

No way is nid that low, and galio, ashe, sona, annie, anivia that high.

Please, please, don't listen to his list. Not only is it wrong, but it refers to only high level play. Just because a high elo player says Anivia is amazing, doesn't mean she's good in your elo.

This is not a pub stomp list. This is aimed for a more High Elo 5v5 approach. Played correctly those t1 are for sure where they should be. The only thing I don't like is the fact that karth is so high, he should be in hard to place.

Other than that make a guide on nidalee udunson, prove him wrong.

[Natu Utan]

ITT: People not understanding Elementz tierlist and complaining about it.

[UglyTractor]

Natu Utan, on 07 October 2010 - 09:05 PM, said:

ITT: People not understanding Elementz tierlist and complaining about it.

This. Nidalee brings nothing to a team fight. This list is for a higher level of play where, as proven in WGC, aoe comps reign. This is simply highlighting who fits into these comps and playstyles the best.

[Natu Utan]

As of right now, the only real "hard counter" to Galio is Udyr.

[Worstcase]

I've no clue where you got the idea of Galio being remotely bad. Yes this is going to turn into a smear campaign, but that's the risk you take when you say things like this. Galio's ultimate is like Amumu's ultimate, straight up hands down does similar things, and some a lot better and a lot worse. Galio's ultimate does several times more damage then Amumu's, and Taunt is a much harder CC then an immobilization/can't attack. Which any remotely smart person would know makes Galio's ultimate right off the bat the superior damage dealer and CCer. The only thing Amumu has better is that it is an instant cast, and such cannot be interupted - unlike Galio's which you'll still be very lucky to do.

I'm not defending Elementz, quite the contrary since me and him don't meet eye to eye, but posting things like this and then ignorantly refuting any other possibilities. Not to mention that anyone who considers Galio as bad has either gotten their opinion from a uninformed friend, just tagged along with the Forums, or deduced that he was bad due to one bad player, either which way it was a pretty stupid move.

[chemistryz]

Pretty much everything ^ he said.

The tier list is for high level play, and it is not wrong.

For the most part he brings a good argument for most of their placement. Would I change a few things? Yes, but that doesn't make it wrong.


Tier lists are for the most part just something you should read and consider, nothing more. They're not the be all and end all.

That's why people crack jokes about elementz' tier list; because it's really just food for thought, not the bible.


I mean he had TF as bottom tier 3 for ever, and EU never stopped using him -- so obviously top tier players don't abide by it.

People in solo queue are always going to be silly and try to be trendy mother fuckers, it's what they do.


But posting that it's WRONG is just ignorant.

[Caddy]

Yeah Udunson, we talked earlier and you really blew it out of proportion and now you just look really really stupid..

I was simply imply I did not agree with the Galio bump, or do I still. Doesn't mean you should go off and say LOLOLLOLOLOLOLOLOKIOKOJOOLOL ELEMENTZ IS FUCKING NOOB AND HAS NO IDEA WHAT HE IS TALKING ABOUT LOLOOLZZZ.

He obviously made it to WCG for a reason.. And he obviously saw some things that worked. So in his eyes of competitive top tier players, Galio is the pick to have, as for you queing as Pantheon, with your awesome buddies, I'd say Galio is a good pick, a strong pick, but not the best. So.. Yeah might want to chill out next time you have free thought in your head.

[DeathProphet26]

You make yourself look like a fool tbh.
His team won WCG, he has been in high elo for quite some time now.
I think he know what he is talking about.

[Worstcase]

DeathProphet26, on 07 October 2010 - 10:38 PM, said:

You make yourself look like a fool tbh.
His team won WCG, he has been in high elo for quite some time now.
I think he know what he is talking about.

Perhaps, but at the same time Elementz applied WCG to his tier list, which in many ways is flawed and at the same time makes perfect sense. That said a tier list really doesn't mean anything, all it is is educated opinion of the high tier masses.

[Nanners]

Worstcase, on 07 October 2010 - 10:46 PM, said:

Perhaps, but at the same time Elementz applied WCG to his tier list, which in many ways is flawed and at the same time makes perfect sense. That said a tier list really doesn't mean anything, all it is is educated opinion of the high tier masses.

Tier lists are based on tournaments.

Previously LoL had no tournaments to base them off of. (or hardly any)

[nuckingfoob]

kid. anivia can crush almost anyone in a solo lane. galio is amazing if played decently and with the right team. annie is hands down the best caster. how do you not see that. janna could be bumped down and mf and vlad bumped up. and i say "could" because thats my opinion. other than that this is a pretty accurate tier list. if you dont like it, go find a tier list made by someone else at 1200 like yourself. im tired of you posting shit like this when you have no place to talk. elementz is better than you will ever be and knows a lot more than you because he has been in so many more situations in general. you make yourself sound ignorant, if not stupid, and the people above agree.