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Are Normals and Ranked games related in any way?


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#1 SauronMustDie

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 09:32 AM

Hey there, TSM community!

I wanted to ask you about your knowledge on the Elo system in Normals and Ranked games, and if they're interlinked. I mean, does your performance in normal games have any influence on your placement in Ranked? Imagine you start out playing Ranked for the very first time and have a negative win ratio in your Normals. Does it have an impact?

What about the other way around? You play Ranked for the most part and have a higher Elo (let's say 1500~), will you be matched with other 1500~ elo players when you go for a Normal Draft or Blind Pick game?

What about your performance last season? How much does that impact your Elo (now LP) gain? As an example: I was about 1150 elo in season 2. Now I am around the same Elo (that is Bronze I, close to promotion), and I gain ridiculously low amounts of LP. I had a few instances where I gained +1 LP, havin 98 in the pocket. Then I lost a game and -5LP. It's like a loop. I was thinking to myself "Does the system hand out less Elo, because I am close to my Season 2 peak?". What do you know about that?

And then on another note, why I started to ask all these questions to myself: Starcraft 2, which has a pretty similar Elo system, had you placed accordingly to your 1v1 ladder rank, as far as I remember (i. e. You were Gold/Diamond in 1v1, and now started some solo 2v2 or 3v3, you would be more likely to get an initialy higher rank from the get-go).

I hope you can give me some insight, or hard facts.

Cheers
Sauron
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#2 That'smyname

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 09:54 AM

The words you said to long and thats bad for me anyways Normal and Ranked aren't dsame
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#3 Taphel

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 10:21 AM

IMO normal is totally randomly matched. I some times get matched with 200 wins or 1500+ wins guys. Maybe it is because of W/L ratio, anyway i dont know.

Ranked is about your "elo". It is not shown anymore, but still exists, basically its your MMR that increases when you win and drop when you lose. Thats why you sometimes can get matched with a platinum guy in gold because he is Plat V and got a so low mmr that he'll get matched with golds.

Anyway ranked and normal stats are not used for each other matchmaking.
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#4 tortillagirl

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 11:19 AM

normals have its own matchamaking mmr.
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#5 TubbyRollos

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:35 PM

The reason that you are having so much trouble in the top of bronze 1 is riot makes the progression slow down an incredible amount in the first division of any league. Because the promotion is permanent they want to make you really work to earn it I guess...

The benefit of this is that in order to go up a league it should spike your MMR a lot and so then it will be much easier to progress once you get promoted.
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#6 Nooblabel

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:59 PM

Duffy.. Only reason I actually read through what you wrote.. There is no standard elo system for normals, its pretty much once you get to 30 you're fresh meat, learn to play with the pros/trolls.. In ranked the mmr takes impact, the elo system has been demolished which sucks. Now you get matched according to your mmr (man>monkey rating), which some have a higher monkey rating so they get matched together, whith the occasional man that's actually trying to progress.

Hope this helps.
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#7 Dominus Ensis

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 02:43 PM

Actually you do have a hidden normal elo, but it is completely unrelated to ranked.
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#8 Foo18

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 07:36 PM

Duffy.. Only reason I actually read through what you wrote.. There is no standard elo system for normals, its pretty much once you get to 30 you're fresh meat, learn to play with the pros/trolls.. In ranked the mmr takes impact, the elo system has been demolished which sucks. Now you get matched according to your mmr (man>monkey rating), which some have a higher monkey rating so they get matched together, whith the occasional man that's actually trying to progress.

Hope this helps.


Nope, normals does have it's own hidden elo. It has no baring on anything other than normals, but it's there. I don't think your ranked elo effects it, but it might. My normals elo is actually higher than my ranked elo right now lol. I constantly get matched with plats and the occasional diamond in a soloq normal game. In ranked, it's mostly golds and a few plats.


How do I know there is a normal elo? Well, I have several bronze (and bronze quality) players on my list. If I spectate them playing a normal game, everybody in there is bronze(ish) too (Or unranked, but bronze quality players). If I play with a bunch or friends who are bad at this game, I get matched up against a bunch of silvers instead.


But in the end, playing normals will get you no points in ranked. However, normals can bee good practice. If you want to try out a strategy for the first time, do it in normals. If you want to pick up a new champ, do it in normals.
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#9 iamjstar

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 08:51 AM

IMO normal is totally randomly matched. I some times get matched with 200 wins or 1500+ wins guys. Maybe it is because of W/L ratio, anyway i dont know.

Ranked is about your "elo". It is not shown anymore, but still exists, basically its your MMR that increases when you win and drop when you lose. Thats why you sometimes can get matched with a platinum guy in gold because he is Plat V and got a so low mmr that he'll get matched with golds.

Anyway ranked and normal stats are not used for each other matchmaking.



Man that must mean ranked games are also TOTALLY RANDOMLY matched because I get matched against players with 2000 wins sometimes....

Both normals and ranked games have ELO/MMR. Each one has their own pool of MMR which is completely separate from the other.
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#10 Nooblabel

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 09:05 AM

Hmph... I've been matched with diamond and plat players in normals before and I was bronze back then.. Only had 200 + - games back then.. I get matched with golds quite often in normals so that's probably why I'm "so good" in ranked vs silvers.. But oh well.
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#11 tortillagirl

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 09:19 AM

those diamonds you played normals with 200 wins probs also only had 200 wins in normals to. thats the point, ranked and normal mmr is completely seperate.
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#12 Nooblabel

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 09:24 AM

They didn't though, they had like 1000 + :/
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#13 iamjstar

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 12:36 PM

They didn't though, they had like 1000 + :/


Their ratio probably sucks. Point is, normal MMR is just like ranked. IF they had 1000 wins and 1200 losses, they'll be at about a silvery level of MMR in normals even though you wouldn't know. So then the next guy that has like 100 wins and 120 losses would get matched up against him despite the difference in total wins.
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#14 Nooblabel

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 02:21 PM

Ah.. Makes sense I guess.. Although I play normals for warm up and fun though.. Seen waaaay too many people taking normal games too seriously.. Its scary, "Wtf you chose blitz mid?! GG report.." "Screen shotted report" .. For what exactly, trying something that's not the META? Off topic much.. But yeah would make sense though, why I don't roflstomp players in normals as much as I used to.
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#15 SauronMustDie

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 11:17 AM

Thank you for all the replies. That helped me out a lot. :lol:
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